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Post Info TOPIC: Thoughts on This Is Hardcore, 8 years later... (well 13 now)
Anonymous

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Thoughts on This Is Hardcore, 8 years later... (well 13 now)
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Ian wrote: I was going to post this in reply to one of the other threads but thought it warranted a thread on its own. I've just been listening to This is Hardcore for the first time in a few months (I've listened to a few of the better songs in that time but not the full album right the way through) and thought I'd share a few of my opinions. I've got to admit that I agree with Jarvis when he says that the first 5 tracks are the best then it starts to go downhill (though I think it picks up towards the end). I mean, The Fear is possibly the best song Pulp have ever used to open an album and live sets and it still sounds brilliant nearly a decade later. Classic. Dishes is good too, especially with all its bells and strings and although Party Hard suffers from a poor vocal, it is pretty much as good as anything on Different Class. Help the Aged is probably one of the best songs on the album but all people seem to see it as is a bad choice for comeback single. Oh well. People will always remain divided on the title-track but it is good work and representative of the album itself. Kind of like the I Spy or Wickerman of This is Hardcore. ...then we get to TV Movie. If you ask me, it is very weak and certainly lacks character. I mean, play The Fear then TV Movie! You'll soon see what I'm on about. A Little Soul follows suit, definitely nowhere near as good as anything else on the album. So it's meant to be as good as Bar Italia or Something Changed, is it? You could have fooled me. I'm a Man is pretty good but if you ask me, it sounds crap when played live. On record, it is as good as Mis Shapes or Disco 2000 but just doesn't stand up for much live. It does sound weaker when placed after TV Movie and A Little Soul because it's as if the standard has to be set again. Seductive Barry is kind of like a darker, longer version of Underwear crossed with Pencil Skirt and it's brilliant. To me it's the equivilant of This is Hardcore on side B and another representative of the album. Sylvia and Glory Days both sound rushed and stand as a blot on the second half. When played live, they are brilliant, maybe they would have sounded better in the hands of Scott Walker but we'll never know. The Day After the Revolution is breathtaking. It's not single material or a live favourite but the ideal ending to the album. I don't know what else to say about this song. Well there you go. That's what I think.



-- Edited by ArrGee on Friday 15th of July 2011 09:22:53 AM

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Anonymous

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Fuss Free wrote:

Thanks for sharing , Ian.

I've just listened to it myself. I think the album has a lot of peaks and valleys, but I like it that way. Sylvia is the only song on the record that feels awkard to me, like it was tossed in as filler when filler wasn't necessary. I used to keep a CDR in my car on which I replaced Sylvia with Like a Friend, the b-side version, and it always seemed to work better.

It's funny, I actually think Different Class is the album that falls apart on Side B. I rarely feel the urge to listen to Live Bed Show, Something Changed, Sorted, Underwear or Bar Italia. I do quite like Feeling and Monday Morning, but they aren't anyway near the top of my Pulp tracks.

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This Space For Rent

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Fuss Free wrote:

It's funny, I actually think Different Class is the album that falls apart on Side B. I rarely feel the urge to listen to Live Bed Show, Something Changed, Sorted, Underwear or Bar Italia. I do quite like Feeling and Monday Morning, but they aren't anyway near the top of my Pulp tracks.


That's interesting... Refraining from the urge to call you a crazy person of dubious tastes, I will say that I find that very interesting. I often can't be bothered listening to the DC singles* - particularly Common People or Disco 2000 - because they're so over-familiar, but once they're actually *playing* they're irresistible. I never have that problem with any of the DC album-only tracks, though, particularly the tail end of the album.

* Something Changed is interesting, in that I remember I *was* starting to get a little tired of it until the single came out. (There's going to be more about this on the revised site, when it finally appears). For some reason, the single and its attendant inlay card, with all its lazily reclining naked people, gave the song a whole different atmosphere in my head which persists to this day.

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Anonymous

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RE: Thoughts on This Is Hardcore, 8 years later...
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Frisko2000 wrote:

the title track is Pulp's masterpiece, in my opinion.

but there was room for improvement on the final TIH album, and this all the more frustrating considering that the material was there. here's what i would have considered a superior THI track listing:

The Fear
Dishes
Party Hard
Help the Aged
This Is Hardcore
The Professional
I'm A Man
We Are the Boyz
Seductive Barry
Cocaine Socialism
Like A Friend (b-side version)

i think that the album would have been stronger thematically AND sold better...

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Anonymous

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The Professional! Yes!
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Ian wrote:

The Professional would have made a great album track. Can't say I agree with the others though. I'm guessing that the rare songs from the This is Hardcore reissue will be brilliant but we'll have to wait and see.

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Anonymous

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Mondo wrote:

YOu think "We Are the Boyz" was better than "The Day After the Revolution"? Honestly?

Some people.


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Anonymous

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RE: Thoughts on This Is Hardcore, 8 years later...
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Frisko2000 wrote:

'We Are the Boyz' was more a sub for 'TV Movie' or 'A Little Soul'. i think that those are the real low points of the album. 'The Day After the Revolution' is probably meant to be a more important song (at least when it was written) but i don't think it's better than 'Like A Friend'. the US version that i've always listened to has always closed with 'Like A Friend'. but i'd almost always hear either song over the fourteen minute 'The Day After the Revolution'...

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Anonymous

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RE: Thoughts on This Is Hardcore, 8 years later...
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pye wrote:

tv movie and a little soul are excellent songs, i dont think that seducive barry and the day after the revolution deserve to be on the album. cocaine socialism was a brilliant b side and it was a good move not to have it on the album, i do think that tv movie should have been the last track on the album and laughing boy and ladies man should have been on the album, this is my ideal track listing

1. the fear
2. help the aged
3. party hard
4. glory days
5. i'm a man
6. this is hardcore
7. Ladies man
8. A little soul
9. Dishes
10. sylvia
11. laughing boy
12. tv movie

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Anonymous

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RE: Thoughts on This Is Hardcore, 8 years later...
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cactus jack wrote:

the thing about this album is that i always have it on me, i think it's still great, tv movie i'd have to agree could have been got rid of but the rest is fantastic, i really like sylvia, i identify with it,

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Anonymous

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RE: Thoughts on This Is Hardcore, 8 years later...
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Jayenkai wrote:

True.. There are bits of TIH that just aren't Pulp like, but you get that with the other albums, too. DC is the only Pulp album that is 100% Amazing, all the way through. But you can live with that. The amazing tracks of any album make up for the non-amazing ones.

It's We Love Life that's crap all the way..

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Jayenkai wrote:

It's We Love Life that's crap all the way..



Heretic! BURN HIM!

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Anonymous

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RE: Thoughts on This Is Hardcore, 8 years later...
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littlesaint wrote:

His n' Hers is 100% amazing all the way through

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Anonymous

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RE: Thoughts on This Is Hardcore, 8 years later...
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The Idiot wrote:


I think His'n'Hers is pretty much the perfect Pulp album, though I'm glad they made the bigger sounding and more successful Different Class rather than try to maintain underground "indie" status. Unfortunately I don't think Mr. Senior agreed with me, and I'm inclined to believe that his departure makes This Is Hardcore (and We Love Life, obviously) a considerably weaker album.

TIH does start well, it's already been mentioned that The Fear is a great opener: I remember some reviewer describing it as the character from Sorted a couple of years down the line, and that's indicative of the album in general; a little more dark, having to deal with the demons and so on.

At various times the mawkishness of Dishes has bothered me: And I'm not worried that I will never touch the stars 'cause stars belong up in heaven and the earth is where we are. Though overall it's a great song.

I don't think Party Hard has a bad vocal, it's just mixed so that the lower octave voice is prominent, and that's harder to enjoy than when Jarv is in a higher register. (Same with The Trees.) I'd definitely like to see Party Hard's vocals remixed, but also Mark Webber's guitar part is a little too ordinary and "rawk" than something Senior would have come up with. Undoubtedly Webber is a better guitarist than Senior, but the latter's style and flair is much stronger, even when playing guitar - he seems to be playing violin lines on guitar, which is so simple as to be sneered at by any "accomplished" musician but it's just that quality that makes it unique and interesting, especially with Pulp's trashy glam feel.

Help The Aged is very good, but too similar in Feel to DC. I expect this is why it was made the comeback single, but it doesn't feel like a development. Still the subject matter is perfect for a TIH album track.

This Is Hardcore the song is utterly fantastic, though an odd choice of single. Maybe it should've been the third single rather than second, a lot of people were probably put off buying the album by this. But the song and accompanying video are among Pulp's greatest triumphs and possibly pop music's too.

TV Movie is weak, almost Pulp-by-numbers. What's become apparent is that - for whatever reason - the songs don't seem to have been honed or developed enough.

I quite like A Little Soul - even the Smokey Robinson reference of the riff and title - but it was another bad choice of single and more evidence (for me) that ideas were running quite low at this point.

I'm A Man is another song that I feel is weakened by the American sounding verse that Russel Senior would have made more interesting, though it's also an example of how Jarvis is one of the best chorus writers in music. A possible single if made "properly".

Seductive Barry is great; it possibly suffers from being among weaker songs, but if the other tracks on this side were really focused and sharp I believe this would have been a lovely indulgence.

Another song with a great chorus and unfulfilled potential. Somehow these songs just sound like the band and Jarvis couldn't get around to finishing the writing properly. Like The Meaning Of Life by Monty Python.

Glory Days sounds like it wants to be anthemic, but there just isn't enough melodically or lyrically to justify that. I'm not familiar with Cocaine Socialism (yet) but it at least sounds interesting and opinionated.

The Day After The Revolution is like Seductive Barry for me: it's dragged down by a few mediocre songs around it. Could've been a good closer, but it's never a Bar Italia and nowhere near a David's Last Summer.

I wonder will the "new" songs on the reissues prove that a much better album could've been made, but it's still better than anything Oasis ever did.

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Anonymous

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Fuss Free wrote:

So what we've learned here today is... we all have wildly differing opinions on Pulp's output. I think that's a good thing, personally. What good is a song that doesn't inspire strong feelings?

I've been listening to Freaks again. I like it more and more.

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Anonymous

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Scotty wrote:

Agreed - I mean reading through this thread, people dont like Day Of The Revolution........what the **** is that all about !!!???!?!?!?!?!

Mind you, I kind of dislike Common People lol - as it simply the only track aside from Disco 2000 or at a push Sorted that Joe Bloggs knows on the street! AND its the only song thats played on the radio.....but thats not a bad thing as its getting airplay STILL since 1995


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Common Person

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Hello,

This Is Hardcore was the first Pulp album I liked. I didn't hear any of His'n'hers (I'm in Australia) and although I did buy Different Class in 1996 I didn't like it very much (I still don't). When I first heard This Is Hardcore I was delighted that a band I had written off as being sub-Parklife could become so very good.

Though now that I have heard all their other albums, I prefer Intro and His'n'hers.

I don't agree btw that This is Hardcore is a "dark" album. Not compared to most of Separations, His'n'hers and the EPs on Masters of the Universe and Intro (though I agree it is dark compared to Different Class). This is Hardcore and Seductive Barry are just fun songs about sex with some rather cringeworthy wordplay, Party Hard is a series of amusing observations about parties, and Dishes and The Day After The Revolution are positive in their resignation, not negative. I suppose The Fear is dark, but it doesn'encourage on to brood the way Countdown or They Suffocate at Night does.



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Couldn't agree more. With the stuff about This Is Hardcore, I mean.

Welcome to the board, theonewhothrowsthelastbookonthefire. What should we call you for short? TOWTTLBOTF?

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Hardcore

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I think it's more the sombre tone and low-pitched vocals that make This Is Hardcore a dark album. Obviously it starts with The Fear, and there are a few other seedy moments, such as were singled out by TheOneWhoTakesTheLastBiscuit, but generally the album has quite a positive, if not hip-hip-hooray happy, feel. It's a three am look-at-your-life album, or a hangover album: world-weary and a bit disillusioned (or even cynical at points). There's certainly less naivety than in any previous Pulp record, more experience and age without the nostalgia of Disco 2000. So, while it's not a bleak or negative album it's still rather dark in a way.

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Quiet Revolutionary

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The Idiot wrote:

It's a three am look-at-your-life album, or a hangover album: world-weary and a bit disillusioned (or even cynical at points). There's certainly less naivety than in any previous Pulp record, more experience and age without the nostalgia of Disco 2000. So, while it's not a bleak or negative album it's still rather dark in a way.



I agree. The Fear is obviously pretty dark, while Dishes and A Little Soul are sad (in a good way). The title track is just incredibly world-weary and cynical in a really powerful way; The way Jarvis makes the fame-as-porn metaphor work for the whole song never fails to knock me out.

I haven't gotten the reissues yet, but I hear in the liner notes to this, Jarvis kinda regrets not making the album entirely dark, but I think that's what makes the album so strong. Glory Days and The Day After the Revolution are cautiously hopeful, and there's something realistic about those songs that I really respond to.

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Quiet Revolutionary

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Also, Party Hard. That's pretty world-weary for such a rockin' tune.

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Anonymous

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8 years later, i still dont get why people dont like a little soul, it's a classic for me : its got soul, emotion, melody, production...everything is basicaly spot on on this track.


i think thi is very well balanced with epics (the fear, sylvia, tih), ballades (a lillte soul, dishes), grrreat fillers (party hard, tv movie)...etc


i would only switch party hard for we are the boyz, but that's only for own liking.


one of the best album ever.



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Mis-Shape

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Having tried to consider the issue before posting, i think perhaps the main problem with TIH is the way the first half of the album 'fits' together, in theme and in sound. The whole "boo-to-fame", "end of the party" thing is great, but i think it forced songs like The Professional and Like A Friend off the album (in the UK at least).

Perhaps breaking the first part of the album up and spreading it would be the answer. I imagine Party Hard following The Professional, for instance, on my own preferred tracklisting. Having said this, i'm not a big fan of trying to re-order album tracklistings as they were as they were for a reason.

-- Edited by John Tween at 22:24, 2006-09-15

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Mis-Shape

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Not that i dislike TIH. It's actually my favourite album for this particular 5 minutes of my Pulp-related life.

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Quantum Theorist

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Anonymous wrote:



8 years later, i still dont get why people dont like a little soul, it's a classic for me : its got soul, emotion, melody, production...everything is basicaly spot on on this track.


i think thi is very well balanced with epics (the fear, sylvia, tih), ballades (a lillte soul, dishes), grrreat fillers (party hard, tv movie)...etc


i would only switch party hard for we are the boyz, but that's only for own liking.


one of the best album ever.





I was listening to Hardcore on holiday a month or two ago, and found it to be more apt to me than it was at the time (and it was pretty apt then).


I think His 'n' Hers is the definitive Pulp album (and Babies/Razzmatazz even more definitive), but Hardcore is currently my favourite apart from that.  I wouldn't switch any of the tracks, nor add to it (though I would abridge the The Day After The Revolution at 5 minutes , as I just skip the rest at the end).


 



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Anonymous

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"A Little Soul" was always going to be a divisive track. It owns more to Johnny Cash than to Ray Davies, and therefore it's the most willlfully anti-britpop song on the record. It's not particularly to my taste either, but I like that they had the balls to do it.

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