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Post Info TOPIC: Very odd & intriguing Jarvis interview Time Out mag 2014


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Very odd & intriguing Jarvis interview Time Out mag 2014
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Deleted to not create anymore drama and arguing. Or future arguing. 

It won't let me delete the thread itself. 



-- Edited by Lentils on Tuesday 23rd of January 2018 10:05:10 PM

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Well, i'd say first it's a human reaction. No-one really want the world to know how much they are worth, except for stupid people who like to brag about their fortune.

Second, Jarvis probably earned enough money in the 90s to never work again, but he's still seen as a relative "man of the people". So maybe fans would be shocked by how much money he has. You cant sing about Common People or misfits when you have millions in the bank...

We can safely assume he's a millionaire, even maybe "multi" millionaire. Let's take Liam Gallagher, or any other membre of Oasis that was not Noel. Only from touring and the small fees from album sales, they made each 50 millions back in the day.

Let's say Pulp had 5x less success in the britpop days, which sounds about right. With shared songwriting credits, Jarvis could easily be worth 10 millions.

This site says 5 millions.

www.celebritynetworth.com/richest-celebrities/rock-stars/jarvis-cocker-net-worth/

But it's usually very underrated because there is investments, reunion tours (big money in 2011/ 2012)...etc.

I'd say the real amount is inbetween. Take the divorce into account, custody and stuff, maybe he indeed has 5 millions left.



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Interesting. Though, I'd assume Oasis has made tenfold what Pulp has..globally especially. And fact Pulp no longer is really a thing to the general public. Unless a reunion tour occurs.
Plus, it probably depends on how each band had funds split and contracts. If I recall, I think Jarvis said in an interview not too long ago that he wasn't a millionaire. Or that they were all briefly millionaires or cusp of it, for a short while.
So, no idea.
Pulp never really made it out of the UK scope. Unfortunately.

Wonder why he's so defiant against being assumed as a millionaire? I mean, he was in a very successful band with big singles, UK tours, it's kind of automatically assumed they'd be at least living comfortably. So no idea why his reaction. And I think he got defiant once before over it. Unless he feels weird or guilty about admitting he is wealthy in midst of fact that his biggest song is about classism and spokesperson for the "common people". But I don't think anyone would blame him for that. Wasn't like he foresaw all this ahead of time. And he deserves it for his work. Nothing wrong with earning a living. And not like he's living it up like a Kardashian. He lives modestly and still in touch with his homebase and roots. So, no reason for him to be ashamed of it. 



-- Edited by Lentils on Thursday 18th of January 2018 09:09:16 PM

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I'd also take those wealth sites with grain of salt.

He's  also said he's well off and other things, though that said, doesn't necessarily mean millionaire...





-- Edited by Lentils on Thursday 18th of January 2018 09:20:52 PM

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Well, those sites aren't very reliable, true, but they give some pretty good informations on a few celebrities. If we take Noel Gallagher for instance, we know he made between 50 / 100 millions with Oasis, and this site says 60 millions, which is probably way below the real number. With that in mind, you can pretty much guess what Jarvis made.

It's all guessing, but really, Pulp was very big in the 90s, an era when record sales were at the highest, radio plays was at the highest and gigs and festivals were also paying well.

Different Class went platinum four times, that means 4 millions records in the UK only. Common People also sold well as a single and had a lot of radio plays (which is a good source of income too). 

An interesting link for record sales : https://bandzoogle.com/blog/record-sales-where-does-the-money-go

Artist (6.6%) Producer (2.2%) Songwriters (4.5%) Distributor (22%) Manufacturing (5%) Retailer (30%) Record label (30%). So that's 11% of total sales to divide between 6 band members. Records were sold at around 20 euros back then (yes they were expensive). You do the maths but roughly, one million each for Different Class in the UK only. Add gigs and festivals (big money).

The Libertines got paid 1 million for one show at Hyde Park. Pulp probably got the same, even maybe a little more... divide that by 6 band members and you got around 170.000 for Jarvis only... for one gig. For the reunion tour, they played a lot of festivals which are paying pretty well...

Take all that into account, and you can safely assume he's a multi-millionaire. If a britpop icon didn't reach the millionaire status, who can ? My guess would be between 5 and 10. 

Then, with the divorce (divide the fortune by half biggrin) and investments, it can all change... It all depends on how they managed their money.

As you said, Jarvis feels probably a bit weird about being a millionaire when he sung about Common People. That's the main reason to me.



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Yikes. Yeah, the divorce. Ouch. That would definitely be a factor.

I just find it crazy he'd still try and deny fact he's a millionaire...that is IF he is, when most people well knowing about Common People and his stance would automatically just assume he is wealthy. It's inevitable. And it's most people are aware of this and also aware he lives modestly and humble and isn't some multi mansion, gold chains, and mega expensive cars type and is down to earth about it. He needs to relax and chill about it.

Now, as for his political stance on leaving it to the young generation, I disagree. Plus, he's been pretty active himself in the like.



-- Edited by Lentils on Friday 19th of January 2018 10:14:59 AM

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Well, for the political thing, I dont agree with him but also, I dont disagree. I mean, if he's living in a wealthy environment, it's pretty hard to know and feel what "real" people suffer from. So in a way, making political songs would be a bit weird.

What I liked with Jarvis lyrics is that they were always pretty smart, and not just "duh, this guy is cunt" (Bono ?). That's why i dont really like "Cunts are Still running the world", i thought it was too simplistic for Jarvis.

And that's also why i love Room 29 because he sings about classes stuff but from a different point of view, from another era, but something that can still be applied today: rich people not taking care of the rest. It's a very smart record, probably his smartest to date.

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I think platinum in the UK is for 250k records, last estimate I saw for Different Class was 1.2m units shifted. I often see the figure of 10m records sold worldwide by Pulp and I've never found a clear source for that claim. Wikipedia got it from a news article which was flimsy enough to be based on "think of a likely, round number". Considering they never crossed-over in the US, I imagine the true figure might be closer to half of that amount.

Also, might be of interest to some that the band members all set-up limited companies at the start of the reunion in 2011. A year later they each reported profits of about £250k - into the £300k's a year later which would take into account the 2012 shows. Of course there are costs to factor in and they may have chosen to be paid for some of the gigs through other means but roughly speaking you can estimate a £15k-£25k per band member per show given the number of festivals/gigs they did. That seems a lot more likely than the £1m Libs reunion-type tabloid talk. I may be wrong, as I said, there's ways of spreading income.

All that company info is on public record at Companies House (best company name is Candida's - "Lovely Doyle Music"!). I work in finance and during idle time once had a nose around.

I think the broader point is that music and the arts is incredibly precarious as a "profession". You really have to make hay while the sun shines and Pulp probably only ever made decent money in 1996 and 2011. That's 15 potentially lean years where you have to consider earning elsewhere. Encroaching middle-age and without other major employable skills etc. would likely be a worry. Royalties are steady but increasingly lower income streams so reunions are often a financial necessity, especially if you have kids coming up to university age and probably even regardless. As Nick once put it, "We did alright but I still ain't got a Lear jet". Also worth taking into account that for DC, the money would be split six ways and for all the Island records, Fire Records received a percentage as per the terms of the group signing to Island. Once you factor in the recording costs on an album which have to be recouped (and TIH and WLL both had very lengthy/expensive recording processes) you can imagine how unstable Pulp's income may have been.

Still, at least they did manage a couple of lucrative periods. Consider the lot of a band in their 20's or 30's now, it's just not viable long-term. So I can understand Jarvis get arsey about quite an ignorant/rude question.



-- Edited by Eamonn on Friday 19th of January 2018 03:38:40 PM

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Eamonn wrote:

Pulp probably only ever made decent money in 1996 and 2011. 


 

I doubt that, especially with live shows. They toured extensively in 98 and that tour was probably very profitable because even though TIH was not a success, they did many many festivals, which are the highest paying gigs. They also made extensive tours in 2001/2002, again with many festivals.

As for the Hyde Park gig, i dont think they were paid the same as in any other festival. This gig is not really a "festival", it's headline show with guests, so the headliner gets way more money. The 1 miilion remark was just for this gig, not the others, and to divide between the six of them.

Also rumored, Pulp sold 10 million records worldwide in their carreer.

Billboard printed in feb 96 that they sold 900.000 worldwide Different class records, and pulpwiki mentions 1.2 millions in the uk only as of 1998. They also had a massive success in europe and Asia, so maybe 2 millions is not too far off.

https://books.google.fr/books?id=Gw8EAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA62&lpg=PA62&dq=Pulp+different+class+sales+worldwide&source=bl&ots=_MDdTNp--i&sig=AFnjvuo6QlcqZklB0hcdX69NmNs&hl=fr&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjl05WhyOTYAhVQKlAKHSs8CxkQ6AEIYzAK#v=onepage&q=Pulp%20different%20class%20sales%20worldwide&f=false

Let's no forget radio plays and tv plays, which used to be an important source of income back in the 90s.

The others are probably milionnaire or just (most people in their 50s now that invested in real estate in big cities are millionaires too...), but Jarvis probably has more money in the bank. Because we have to take into account Jarvis solo where he gets 100% of the profit wheareas he only got 1/6 in Pulp. Again, many festivals, especially in 2006.

Overall, i highly doubt Jarvis made less than 5 millions (after tax) in his whole career. What he has left is another matter. biggrin



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andy wrote:

Well, for the political thing, I dont agree with him but also, I dont disagree. I mean, if he's living in a wealthy environment, it's pretty hard to know and feel what "real" people suffer from. So in a way, making political songs would be a bit weird.

What I liked with Jarvis lyrics is that they were always pretty smart, and not just "duh, this guy is cunt" (Bono ?). That's why i dont really like "Cunts are Still running the world", i thought it was too simplistic for Jarvis.

And that's also why i love Room 29 because he sings about classes stuff but from a different point of view, from another era, but something that can still be applied today: rich people not taking care of the rest. It's a very smart record, probably his smartest to date.


 Very cool points!



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Eamonn wrote:

I think platinum in the UK is for 250k records, last estimate I saw for Different Class was 1.2m units shifted. I often see the figure of 10m records sold worldwide by Pulp and I've never found a clear source for that claim. Wikipedia got it from a news article which was flimsy enough to be based on "think of a likely, round number". Considering they never crossed-over in the US, I imagine the true figure might be closer to half of that amount.

Also, might be of interest to some that the band members all set-up limited companies at the start of the reunion in 2011. A year later they each reported profits of about £250k - into the £300k's a year later which would take into account the 2012 shows. Of course there are costs to factor in and they may have chosen to be paid for some of the gigs through other means but roughly speaking you can estimate a £15k-£25k per band member per show given the number of festivals/gigs they did. That seems a lot more likely than the £1m Libs reunion-type tabloid talk. I may be wrong, as I said, there's ways of spreading income.

All that company info is on public record at Companies House (best company name is Candida's - "Lovely Doyle Music"!). I work in finance and during idle time once had a nose around.

I think the broader point is that music and the arts is incredibly precarious as a "profession". You really have to make hay while the sun shines and Pulp probably only ever made decent money in 1996 and 2011. That's 15 potentially lean years where you have to consider earning elsewhere. Encroaching middle-age and without other major employable skills etc. would likely be a worry. Royalties are steady but increasingly lower income streams so reunions are often a financial necessity, especially if you have kids coming up to university age and probably even regardless. As Nick once put it, "We did alright but I still ain't got a Lear jet". Also worth taking into account that for DC, the money would be split six ways and for all the Island records, Fire Records received a percentage as per the terms of the group signing to Island. Once you factor in the recording costs on an album which have to be recouped (and TIH and WLL both had very lengthy/expensive recording processes) you can imagine how unstable Pulp's income may have been.

Still, at least they did manage a couple of lucrative periods. Consider the lot of a band in their 20's or 30's now, it's just not viable long-term. So I can understand Jarvis get arsey about quite an ignorant/rude question.



-- Edited by Eamonn on Friday 19th of January 2018 03:38:40 PM


 

So much more complex than people assume. Great info also, Eamonn. 

 

They should do another mini reunion tour. or just a few shows. Especially USA given I am sure many would be blown away by them and even get them some belated exposure. Can't see why things like Coachella and the like wouldn't take them on in a heartbeat. Big money, too. Easier taking into account how big Jarvis is currently with festivals overseas. 

 



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You may be right Andy, we're taught to be prudent in accounting so my estimates are at the lower-end based on the facts/numbers I know of.


Pulp's legacy is pretty strong and they've managed it pretty well since the split - a one-off doc about Common People in 2005, nicely-curated and well-received reissues of the three main Island albums as well as the Peel sessions, the reunion with next to no press or interviews where they toured much of the world, a well-regarded film after their last show (for which they finally did some press for - mostly individually. The sight of Mark Webber doing a press conference in Mexico for the film, complete with Spanish interpreter was just bizarre/wonderful) and a new song given away/performed once on prime time TV. It's been all tasteful and dignified with some mystery retained, and given the way they limped out of the limelight in 2002 with Hits not selling many copies at the time and their farewell show being mixed-in with a festival etc. it's been satisfying as a fan to see them get their dues since.


For some reason I had a strong feeling that they would do some shows this year of This Is Hardcore in full with a string quartet (maybe even an orchestra) to mark twenty years or something but if Jarvis is road-testing a batch of new material, maybe more live Pulp will have to wait. And I'm pretty happy with that - new Jarvis material will always trump another live reunion for me.



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I would rather new music as well opposed to another reunion.. or reunion including new music.

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Lentils wrote:

I would rather new music as well opposed to another reunion.. or reunion including new music.


Personally, I wonder if Candida's arthritus is the strongest impediment to any future Pulp gigs. As we have known them, in any case. I found the footage of her describing her long-standing struggles (and doubting that a reunion would ever be possible) so touching, and could never had guessed that the girl in the wig in the DC cover was a sufferer. I hope she's doing ok.

I could imagine an orchestral adaptation of TIH, especially since the pre-union performance of the title track at the Southbank back in, what, 2005? But surely not a touring concern. Best start saving in case a tout's services are required...



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A proper follow up to Further Complications is what I want the most.

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